The Leading Learning Podcast is the show for people in the business of adult continuing education, professional development, and lifelong learning.
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Learning is both a natural, intuitive activity all humans engage in and a complicated process we haven’t yet fully appreciated or understood. While there are plenty of nuances and neuroscientific details that factor in, fundamentally learning requires three elements: motivation, time, and effort. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, num…
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424: Audiences and Products, Existing and New
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Fundamentally there are only two factors to consider when looking to grow the reach, revenue, and impact of your learning business: audiences (those you sell to) and products (what you sell). In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, number 424, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele break down four high-level approaches to growing your learni…
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423: Pursuing Quality with IACET's Randy Bowman
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In a crowded and competitive market, high quality signaled by accreditation can help a learning business stand out. That’s why we wanted to talk with Randy Bowman, president and CEO of the International Accreditors for Continuing Education and Training, a nonprofit standards development and accrediting body. In episode 423, Randy talks with Leading…
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Competitive advantage, whether sustained or transient, is becoming harder and harder to maintain. Collaborative advantage may be the answer. In this episode, number 422, we recap competitive advantage, sustained advantage, and transient advantage and then posit a fourth type of advantage for learning businesses to consider: collaborative advantage.…
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421: Empowering Learning Business Leaders
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Self-reflection is an important tool for learners and an important activity for learning business leaders. Dr. Will Thalheimer includes a succinct list of what a great learning leader should be in his book The CEO’s Guide to Training, eLearning & Work. In episode 421 of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele use his list…
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420: Not Calling the Shots with Kemi Jona
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Learning businesses are part of the third sector of education—the sector that serves the adult learner after they work through the K-12 sector and, then for some, the degree-granting higher education sector. Higher education institutions are increasingly playing a role in serving lifelong and continuing learners. Kemi Jona is the vice provost for o…
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In our Learning Business Maturity Model, marketing is one of the five fundamental domains learning businesses need to work on and in to mature and be successful. The Inquiring Mind by Cyril Houle was written in 1961, but it’s a foundational text that can still provide learning businesses with a better understanding of the motivations of the learner…
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For learning businesses, it’s important to truly understand the learners they aim to serve. To help with that understanding, in this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, number 418, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele turn to a text that’s over 60 years old but still incredibly relevant. In The Inquiring Mind, Cyril Houle divides lifelong lear…
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It’s gotten incredibly easy to produce and consume content. That means the market value of content is approaching zero. And that means that learning businesses need to provide more than just content. Learning businesses that can provide connection are going to attract and retain passionate and engaged learners. Ginger Johnson focuses her work on th…
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If you’re looking to improve the reach, revenue, and impact of your learning business, focus on engagement, not content. Content is no longer king. Engagement is everything. In episode 416 of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele talk about why the importance of content and even context is waning and why a focus on enga…
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415: Looking for Balance: Online and Off
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Finding the right balance of online and offline learning to have in a portfolio is one of the critical concerns facing learning businesses in our post-pandemic world because getting that mix as close to ideal as possible is key to securing a learning business’s reach, revenue, and impact. In episode 415 of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jef…
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414: The Duty of Foresight with Jeff De Cagna
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On January 1, 2025, we’ll enter the second half of the turbulent 2020s and come that much closer to the Threatening 30s, to borrow the terms of our guest for episode 414 of the Leading Learning Podcast. Organizations of all kinds have a vested interest in seeing the future as clearly as possible and taking action—action to bring about the best poss…
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413: The Evolving Market for Lifelong Learning
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For learning businesses that want to thrive in the evolving lifelong learning market, identifying metatrends and unpacking what they might mean in terms of risks and opportunities is crucial. In episode 413 of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele offer ten metatrends they see when looking at how lifelong learning is sh…
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412: Building a World That Learns Better
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What does a world that learns better look like? It’s an intriguing question for learning businesses to consider because learning businesses have an opportunity and a responsibility to build a world that learns better, and it’s that question that Leading Learning Podcast co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele explore in episode 412. The question has a…
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411: The Messy Middle with Geoff Stead
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We’ve reached a point in history where it’s essentially a given that learning products will make use of technology to deliver, support, or deepen learning. Geoff Stead has dedicated his career to building learning tools that sit in what he calls the messy middle between the power of new technologies and real human learning needs. He’s currently chi…
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410: AI Adoption: Barriers and Accelerators
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Capacity deals with the people and the technology a learning business has in place, and capacity has a quantitative and a qualitative aspect. How well can the people and the technology do the work, and how much can the people and the technology do? Artificial intelligence has the potential to change both the quality and the quantity of work that a …
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409: Using Data to Drive Decision-Making
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There are many ways to look at data. Two views that can be clarifying for learning businesses are the performance view and the potential view. You can use data to understand how you’re doing currently. How is your learning business performing? You can and should also use data to understand possibilities. How could you be doing? What products and se…
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408: Authenticity in Marketing with Michelle Brien
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Effective marketing is integral to a learning business’s success. But doing marketing well requires care and thought. In this episode, number 408, Leading Learning Podcast co-host Celisa Steele talks with Michelle Brien, vice president of marketing at Matchbox, who approaches her work with care and thought and authenticity. Celisa and Michelle talk…
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The third sector of education can be difficult for learners to navigate, and pathways can help learners. Having guides along the pathways can help even more. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, number 407, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele draw on a recent guided trekking experience to offer six takeaways about the value of guides t…
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406: Nondisruptive Creation, Part II
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In the Tagoras Learning Business Maturity Model, strategy is one of the five fundamental domains learning businesses need to work on and in to mature and be successful. To help with your essential strategy work, in this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, number 406, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele talk about “Part Two: How to Realize Non…
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405: The Science of Engagement with Clark Quinn
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We often hear learning businesses say they want to better engage their learners. But what is engagement, and how does it work? In this episode, Leading Learning Podcast co-host Jeff Cobb digs into those questions with Clark Quinn, executive director of Quinnovation and author of Make It Meaningful: Taking Learning Design from Instructional to Trans…
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Strategy is one of the five fundamental domains in the Learning Business Maturity Model. And most learning business leaders know that strategy is important. But truly understanding strategy and formulating intelligent strategy? That’s trickier. To help with that understanding and formulation, in this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, number …
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You can think of this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast as an origin story. Co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele talk about the relationship between Leading Learning and Tagoras, about what Tagoras is and does, and about the start of Leading Learning. Along the way they touch on the kinds of things that learning businesses need to be able to …
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402: A Curious Conversation About AI with Julian Stodd
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If anything, we should all be able to agree that generative artificial intelligence is a curious thing, worthy of reflection and exploration. Julian Stodd is a researcher, an artist, an explorer, a writer, and captain and founder of Sea Salt Learning, which helps organizations set strategy and change direction. He is also a firm believer in working…
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401: Developing Business for a Learning Business
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Many skills are needed to create and sustain a successful learning business: financial know-how, marketing acumen, instructional design, to name just a few. But one area that often isn’t invested in—or invested in adequately—is business development. Leading Learning Podcast co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele discuss what a business development pr…
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400: 20 x 20 Vision for Lifelong Learning
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We’re at an important point in time for lifelong learning. Much is shifting and unsettled in how humans live and work. That unsettledness means opportunity if your learning business is willing to grapple with the uncertainty and shape a vision for its role in the lifelong learning market. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Je…
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399: Transformational Partnerships with Bruce Rosenthal
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To realize their fundamental mission of developing and delivering learning products and services, learning businesses need revenue. Along with direct-to-learner fees for enrollments and registrations, sponsorship dollars are often a key part of that revenue equation. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-host Jeff Cobb talks with Bruc…
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398: The Difficulty of Desirable Difficulties
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Learning businesses care about creating effective learning. Doing so is at the heart of why learning businesses exist. But what happens when effective learning practices clash with what learners want or what they believe is effective? That clash is precisely what Leading Learning Podcast co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele explore in this episode,…
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Learning, education, and professional development are not the same. Similar, yes, interrelated even, but fundamentally and importantly different. If learning businesses take the parochial view of learning as merely education, they unnecessarily limit their impact and their possibilities. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jef…
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396: Storytelling for Businesses with Park Howell
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Everybody loves a good story. It’s what draws us to good books, good movies, good podcasts. And we know that good stories can draw prospective learners to us and the learning experiences we offer. But telling a good story is harder than it looks, particularly in the realm of business, where often too much emphasis is put on numbers, data, and build…
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395: Digital Credentials Aren’t Valuable Unless…
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Digital credentials aren’t as valuable on their own as they are in an ecosystem that uses open standards to connect learners and employers and where relevant data about skills achieved, pathways to new roles, and the needs of the job market intersect. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa talk about standard…
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Learning businesses rely on the revenue that comes from their educational offerings. That means learning business professionals have to know how to determine the best pricing—the best pricing for attracting and converting prospective customers, the best pricing for maintaining and maximizing revenue levels, and the best pricing for achieving strate…
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393: Personalization and AI with Erica Salm Rench
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With the release of ChatGPT in November 2022, artificial intelligence broke into the mainstream and became a more practical rather than theoretical topic than ever before. AI has the potential to lighten the existing load and to enable new activities for learning businesses, particularly in the realms of marketing and personalization. Erica Salm Re…
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Just as taking time to look back and reflect is a good practice, so too is taking time to look ahead and plan. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele share survey data about what learning businesses plan to focus on in 2024. You can use the data for quick benchmarking and to help you get clearer about …
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Reflection is a good practice, in life and in learning, especially for those working in and for learning businesses. But it’s all too easy to skip because taking time to reflect often isn’t as pressing and urgent as other things on the to-do list. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele act as avatars a…
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390: Redux: Strategic Doing with Ed Morrison
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Strategy and collaboration in open, loosely connected, complex networks require a different approach than the top-down planning that has long dominated organizational strategy-setting. In this redux episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-host Celisa Steele talks with Ed Morrison, who pioneered Strategic Doing, an approach to strategy and colla…
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389: Redux: The Art and Science of Feedback
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Giving and receiving feedback is harder than most people think. Learning business professionals need to take the time to study the art and science of feedback because of the critical role feedback plays in learning. In this redux episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-hosts Jeff Cobb and Celisa Steele discuss how to give and receive feedback e…
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388: Trustworthy Marketing with Melanie Deziel
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Trust is fundamental in marketing. Without trustworthy marketing, products and services, no matter how excellent, will languish because today, by default, audiences doubt what marketers say. What this means is learning businesses need to do the work to collect and use evidence to back up their marketing claims. In episode 388 of the Leading Learnin…
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387: Measuring Marketing with Greg Stuart
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Marketing has arguably undergone more change in the last decade than any other field, which means learning businesses have to stay on top of their marketing game to make sure they reach the right learners and bring in the critical revenue that keeps them humming along. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, number 387, co-host Celisa Stee…
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What is capacity? The dictionary defines capacity as “the facility or power to produce, perform, or deploy.” But we dig deeper to look at what capacity means for learning businesses. We explore three key facets of capacity (people, technology, and processes), look at capacity both as an assessment of current reality and a way to think about an idea…
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385: Awakening Organizational Culture with Catherine Bell
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You’ve heard it said that culture eats strategy for lunch, and getting culture right is arguably even more important for learning businesses than for other types of organizations because the creation of a culture that truly embraces learning is so integrally tied to both what a learning business does internally and what it offers externally. This m…
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384: Successful Decision-Making with Jack Flaherty
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On average, we make 35,000 decisions a day. The sheer quantity means a process for making effective, successful decisions is a foundational aspect of leadership. But decision-making isn't often taught in school or on the job. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, number 384, co-host Celisa Steele talks with Jack Flaherty, author of The D…
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383: Learning Styles and Learner Preferences
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Learning styles are a pernicious myth, but learner preferences are a reality that learning businesses disregard at their own risk. Learning businesses need to balance using effective learning strategies and approaches with giving learners want they want. Show notes and a downloadable transcript are available at https://www.leadinglearning.com/episo…
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382: Design Learning for Behavior Change with Julie Dirksen
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Learning businesses that look for results strive to change behavior. They want to develop and deliver learning experiences that support learners in doing something new or doing something better. But designing for behavior change requires a specific focus and understanding of how learning works. Luckily, Leading Learning Podcast co-host Jeff Cobb ge…
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381: Tripling Learning Effectiveness with Brian McGowan
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This episode will take 30+ minutes to listen to—or less if you like to speed up the audio. But, however long it takes you to get through the episode, we hope you’ll take away at least three things you can use in your learning business. Find a sheet of paper or open a note-taking app, and write down the numbers 1, 2, and 3. As you listen to this con…
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380: Do This Not That for Learning Businesses
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The average learning business does a lot. Add what a learning business could or should do to what it already does, and the list of possibilities is overwhelming. This episode of the Leading Learning Podcast focuses on four often-overlooked areas where we think investing more time and energy will pay off for learning businesses: supporting subject m…
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379: Learner Surveys and Learning Effectiveness with Will Thalheimer
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Developing effective learning products should be a central goal of all learning businesses, and one way to gauge effectiveness and then refine learning products is with learner surveys. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, co-host Jeff Cobb talks with a true expert in the domains of learner surveys and learning effectiveness: Dr. Will T…
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378: Evidence-Based Learning with Jane Bozarth
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Learning businesses should base their design choices on evidence-based practices. But keeping up with the latest research takes time and energy that many learning business professionals simply don’t have. Luckily, people like Jane Bozarth exist to help bridge the gap between academic research and the implications for the design and delivery of lear…
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Practice is a powerful tool for learning, and, when you stop to look at what you do on a daily or weekly basis, you’ll see how common and natural practice is in so many realms. But too often learning businesses don’t incorporate practice into their portfolio of offerings. In this episode of the Leading Learning Podcast, we focus on practice, but, r…
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376: Talking Learning, Leadership, and Results with AMA’s Manny Avramidis
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Soft skills training is a different beast than technical training, and Manny Avramidis, president and CEO of the American Management Association, knows this well. AMA provides management development and educational services to individuals and organizations in over 100 countries, with a primary focus on soft skills. In this episode of the Leading Le…
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