Episode 339: Q&A Part 2 with Fuelin’s Scott Tindal

Purple Patch Podcast

Welcome to the Purple Patch Podcast!

Matt Dixon and Scott Tindal discuss the evolving landscape of nutrition in endurance sports, particularly in IRONMAN Triathlon. Scott, co-founder of Fuelin, talks about establishing a foundation of healthy eating habits, including 6-9 servings of vegetables per day, 2 pieces of fruit, and appropriate protein intake (1-2 grams per pound of body weight). Focus on sleep quality and aim for 7-9 hours of time in bed per night. Increase daily movement and non-exercise activity, not just relying on structured workouts. ​​They also mention in the off-season to consider stress management techniques and finding the right balance of productive stress. Follow IRONMAN Master Coach Matt Dixon as he discusses the latest nutrition and fitness trends.

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Episode Timestamps:

00:00-2:43 Introduction

2:50-50:00 Meat and Potatoes

Episode Timestamps:

00:00-02:46

2:50-End

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00:00

I'm Matt Dixon, and welcome to the purple patch podcast. The mission of purple patch is to empower and educate every human being to reach their athletic potential. Through the lens of athletic potential, you reach your human potential. The purpose of this podcast is to help time starved people everywhere integrate sport into life.

00:29

Welcome to the purple patch podcast, as ever your host Matt Dixon, and today we are on part two of our coaches, conversations with Scott Tindal. Scott is the co founder of fueling, one of the preeminent influences in how athletes are fueling and hydrating their races across all endurance sports. And Scott is a pretty much a regular on the show now, and today, we're going to get back down to basics a little bit, because we're ending the year and we're all looking forward, looking to up level over the course of the coming year. And I thought would be fun to have Scott's perspective across three main areas. Number one, if you're an athlete seeking to up level your performance, what can you be doing right now to lay the foundation as it relates to eating and, as you'll find out sleeping as well. The second category I want to jump into is to gain Scott's advice and some simple application on what you should do if you are really focused on improving your body composition, some of the ABCs of that. And it turns out that you've got a lot of control on how to improve the area. And then finally, what is for Scott's perspective as it relates to longevity, making sure you're setting yourself up for the best quality of life for the years ahead. We straight outside of nutrition. There we talk about movement, sleep, stress reduction, and some key habits around both your eating and your daily hydration. It's fun packed. It's a coach's conversation, and it's really insightful. I think you're going to enjoy it. And so without further ado, I'm going to give you Scott dinner. But one small note as well, if you want to find out more about fueling, simply head to fueling.com/purple.

02:16

Patch, the team are always ready to reach out and help with any of your needs, you can also find all of the information on purple patch programming at purple patch fitness.com and if you want to have a direct connect to the team at fuel in or if you want to reach out to us directly and extend the conversation, simply ping us an email [e-mail]

02:36

We'll be delighted to set up a complimentary consultation. But without further ado, I give you. Scott Tindal, it is time for the meat and potatoes.

02:50

It is the meat and potatoes. So here's a question for you. Are you an athlete that is looking ahead to next year and thinking, I want to take my performance to the next level? Or perhaps you're someone that really wants to improve your body composition, or, Further still, he's someone that wants to build a platform of daily energy where you want to set yourself up for a high quality of life for the years ahead, if you're any one of those people, or perhaps all three. And then this is the show for you, because I've welcomed back my guest. I would call him my master guest, because he's been on the show so much now. Scott Tindal from fuel in welcome Scotty. Matty, good to see you again. Last week, we had a nice chat about uh Kona and some broader perspectives on triathlon. Now we're going to expand our horizons a little bit, and I want to have some common advice as we start to enter into the end of the year, and most people are looking ahead. They're getting ready to commit to their New Year's resolutions and all of that stuff. But I want to get some general advice for you, and I'm going to go just very simply with three questions of, what should we focus on if you're an athlete, if you're looking for body composition changes, if you're looking for improving your longevity and daily quality of life and what you bring to your role, or anything that's important to you. Very, very simple stuff, really practical guidance and advice and and I will say, before we dive into this, we talked a lot in last week's show about fueling. We talked a lot about athletics, race fueling. Some observations around Kona. If you guys missed that show, I really recommend you go back. It was a treasure trove of perspective and and really interesting insights. Today, we're going to get a little bit more practical and and really rip the meat off the bone, as it were. And I want to start with talking about the athlete first and and let's

04:46

let most athletes at this phase of the year are in what we call off season, so it's a far away in the horizon that their race goals and their start lines are their training demands.

05:00

Levels are much lower. Specificity is actually probably lower. So far as not really training race specificity right now, they're doing a lot of foundational work. So as a nutritionist, what would be your recommendation for athletes thinking about charting their journey for higher performance. What should they be focusing on right now, in terms of eating, fueling, supporting training, demands, hydration, how should they an athlete think about it? Because most of them stop thinking about it. Yeah, I think it's a really good question. And actually probably for all three problems that you described at the start, my answer would probably be very similar, actually, but we can get into the nitty gritty of that. I mean, firstly, I think, reflect on what's happened in the season past, yeah, with either yourself or with your coach or with your team around you, and say, Well, where do we do well, where do we not go? Well, take the army Schwarzenegger approach. Cut, cut your pants off at the knees so you can see your calves at every opportunity and say, Well, this is my weakness. How am I going to develop that weakness to become a strength? And so, okay, you're that high perform, that athlete who wants high performance. Where was the high performance missing? Where are you going to direct your efforts to maybe you weren't strong enough. Okay, so what is the big picture of the macro cycle of the next 12 months look like? What's the overarching goal for that? And that's, you know, going to be a discussion. And then how does things, obviously, specifically, how does nutrition fit with that? If you need to build muscle because you're a bit weaker, then your calorie intake is going to be really important. You have to be in a caloric surplus. You have to be manipulating your protein and certainly your carbohydrates around your training to maximize the impact of that. So just want to pause that, because I think that's really important. If weakness, if general weakness, is an area to attack and you want to build strength. It's not just about going to the gym. It's not just about training. There is a nutritional component that are critical. You need to be in a surplus. I want to double underline that. So just just explain what this and then when you say manipulating protein, what do you mean by that practical? So, yeah, I mean and again, why? Even from a training perspective, I would counter that and say it's not just about lifting weights. It's it's lifting weights with a purpose, yes, with an intensity. It's with a focus. So, you know, if you want to have hypertrophy, there's a certain rep range, there's a certain set range, there's a certain rest period that you need to be focusing on. And everyone's so worried I'm going to get bulky, it's like, Oh, come on. Like, yeah, even if you did get a bit bulky, is that going to be the worst thing for you at the start of the off season, probably, you know, every triathlete or insurance athlete throughout the year is most likely, as you highlighted last week. You know, I've shrunk,

07:52

you will most likely either maintain your lean mass or probably potentially lose a little bit as the season goes Yeah. So don't be too paranoid about that. Look, in terms of structuring overall calorie intake is probably the most important thing, overall protein intake, in terms of across the 24 hours and the weeks and the months, is going to be super important. Same with carbohydrate intake, positioning it around your training. Yes, it's important. It's probably not the most important thing, not nearly as as important as with endurance training. That's pretty clear from what we're seeing the duration of the training sessions. Yeah, for most lifting sessions, you're not going to need to eat anything during this session, certainly taking in something before thinking about that, not going in faster. Again. It's not equivocal.

08:42

It doesn't mean you, everyone, will benefit from eating something going into training. However, the research supports, and certainly there's a correlation, if you do eat before a strength session, and this is certainly our philosophy at fuel in, eat something before, don't go in fasted. More likely you'll push more weight and you'll do more repetitions. What does that equate to? Probably better results

09:06

afterwards, making sure you're not you know, done to admit and fasting in and around strength training, if you want to again, increase strength and power and size, because if you neglect your body of fuel, protein, fat and carbohydrates, and obviously, total, that's total calories, then you won't get the results you need. So I think having a plan around a plan, you've got your training plan, you should have a nutrition plan. And I think again, I say this time and time again, I always laugh, off season, pre season, whatever you want to call it, oh, I don't need, I don't need nutrition plan. Are you going to eat? Isn't it easier to not have to think about the way in which you're eating and just follow a plan, much like you would with a training plan? Surely, that's just an easy way. We've got a.

10:00

Lot going on in our lives. Reduce the, you know, the guesswork, eliminate the decision paralysis, just get on with it. What's the one thing I'll say? And I was talking to Jonathan co founder about this, and it's, or I always go back to it. It's like, everyone wants this sexy approach to, like everything, and it's like, eat, well, eat with purpose. Train, well, train with purpose. Sleep, well, sleep with purpose. Like habit development, yeah, it's just not that cool, yeah, and it takes effort. You've got to be consistent with it to get the results. But when we see athletes do all those three things really well, you know, what happens? Great results. They improve. Yeah, it's, it's true. I want to broaden your horizon a little bit outside of, we went down the rabbit hole of of, you know, strength and building muscle. About a year ago, we had a conversation you had you said something really interesting for the athlete right now. You just talked about, there's so much stuff to be thinking about

11:09

in the middle of the season when an athlete is training for a race in the midst, by the way, because most of our listeners are time starved amateurs of life carrying on. They have this looming deadline. Training is at its highest intensity. You know, they have almost no time, and they're trying to crack the code of race fueling. We now remove that training a little bit less, a little less specificity on the training, at least so far as the race specificity, it's a great time. A year ago, you talked about, this is the time that you want to build the great platform of really high quality eating. Can you explain that concept a little bit like in off season, you want to get your daily eating dialed in when your caloric demands are a little bit lower. So just, just break that down, because I thought that was a real sort of unlock for many of our athletes last year. Ah, I see, yeah. I think in a lot of athletes don't eat well, well, a lot of people don't eat well. I think you've only got to look at the state of the world at the moment, whether it be the USA, Australia, or the UK or globally. So I think you know, what does that mean? I think again, bring it back into simple terms, yeah, aiming six to seven, six, probably six to nine serves of vegetables a day that no one's a vegetable. No one's doing it, no one's doing it. Look, I struggle to it's practically very challenging. Yeah, certainly can get to six lunch and dinner. Yep, can certainly just bulk out the plate with six, you know, six serves of veggies breakfast, if it is a cooked breakfast, throwing in extra a couple of handfuls of, you know, the spinach. Yeah, couple of handfuls of spinach, spring greens and whatnot. So that certainly increases fiber intake. Everyone talks about gut health. How do you improve gut health? It's not through probiotics. Even the research around probiotics is pretty scared these days in terms of showing clear evidence of effect. What seems to be showing effect is prebiotics. Prebiotics being fiber, certainly insoluble, soluble fiber, which the gut microbiome feeds on. That's what it thrives on. Where do you get fiber from you get it from vegetables. Even the research on fiber, like inulin, found in all these products, is a little bit iffy. So powdered, sort of fiber sources maybe don't do even though they say fiber, maybe they're not doing exactly what real fiber does, real real food. Yeah, like, that's the solution. Eat. Don't take a powder. Eat food. Tons of fiber. Eat real food. Yeah, so come to it. That's number one. Fiber, any fiber, fruit, vegetables, two, two pieces of fruit a day. Don't be scared of fruit. Yes, I always say no one got fat eating fruit. So fruit one of my favorite quotes as well. So there's fruit, there's number one, bedrock. Boil it down for it super simple, yeah, fruit and veggies, I think that's your mainstay. Now that's not going to that will provide great micronutrition. There is obviously some macro nutrition within that, in terms of carbohydrates. Certainly, leafy greens and those types of vegetables aren't going to contain a lot of carbohydrates, so you need to layer on top, but you can still choose other vegetables, potatoes, sweet potatoes, parsnips, root vegetables, beets, good layer those on top based on what you require, if you need more carbohydrates than that. Again, two sources, whole wheat breads, good quality bread, sourdoughs,

14:40

brown rices and a lot of that is dependent on your caloric expenditure, likes and training. Yeah, and again, if you talk, you're thinking of that second athlete who is maybe trying to improve body composition. Yes, calories matter. Yep, we're going to get into that. What about protein? Because what we're doing is laying the foundation. So we've got all these we've got fibers. It's.

15:00

Pressure, then you've got this throttling effect of that. Let's call it the more starchy carbohydrates you want to choose good quality ones. And that's dependent so that you want to think about that as a lever, almost where you you or a throttle. You throttle up the carbs as your caloric expenditure comes. What about proteins and fats? People are very interested in that, yep, and even just before that. So, you know, visually, when you're looking at either your plate is three quarters of your plate filled with vegetables, that's probably a good place to start. Or at least, you know, two to three fists of vegetables as well, if you, if you whichever visualization you want. So I think that's a really good place to start. How much of my plate is filled with, you know, fruits and vegetables is a good place then protein. I think protein is a really good place to start again from a foundational perspective, because you might be on low calorie or lower calorie intake again to try and improve body composition, but you can still take in moderate to high amounts of protein, which is still part of that calorie puzzle. So in doing that, not only you'll probably increase satiation, so your feelings of fullness, which prevents you hopefully snacking and taking in extra calories, if that is again, your goal,

16:16

you are hopefully improving immune function by taking in higher amounts of protein, which is going to be essential, because, you know, on a lower calorie intake, there is the potential for susceptibility to upper respiratory tract infections and whatnot, if you're continuously in a caloric deficit as a result of maybe too much training and things so. And again, male to female differences. Males may be a little bit more robust in terms of their ability to withstand that versus females, again, not going to get into the weeds of why that is. It's just what we observe,

16:52

protein for building lean mass, essential for retaining lean mass, essential

17:00

for bone health, essential. You hear tales of our increased protein intake, it causes leaching of calcium from bones. Actually, that's not the truth. Look at the research. The research says actually, those individuals who are taking more protein tend to have better bone mineral density. So again, from a habit perspective, taking in and plant protein fine. The difference, again, it used to be our plant protein is inferior to animal protein. Actually, it doesn't really, it's not really supported by the research these days, as long as you're getting the equivalent of total protein from plant sources as animal now, in order to get more of a challenge to get the plant protein means you've got to eat a hell of a lot more, and often with plant protein sources, well, what do they come with? They come with more fat, and in particular, more carbohydrates, which now makes it difficult if you're trying to keep total calories down. Yeah. So that's where the plant diet becomes more of a, not a struggle, but more of a puzzle, and certainly requires more planning in order to do it. Well, yep, because you can be a plant based, a plant based athlete, and eat terribly. You can eat Margarita pizzas. Yeah, you can eat Doritos. You can drink Coke and you can eat all the white bread in the world. Yep, you're a vegan athlete. Yeah, congratulations. You also eat like crap, yep. So again, foundational, good quality food, whether you're plant based or whether you're animal based, thinking about the quality, thinking about, then how does my calorie intake work with that. And then, what am I trying to achieve? So on, on, on a simple thing, you said, a nice sort of visualization of three quarters of plate or two fists of vegetables. Is there any algorithm or rule of thumb so far as just general people, what? What should they be consuming on a day to day basis, of protein? So hand of proteins and nice little hand in every meal that they consume. I mean, again, total size of the athlete now, yeah, but it's a good work. What you weigh in pounds?

19:13

Protein consuming protein in grams per day. That's a nice little look. That's somewhere between two and three grams per kilo, exactly. So I weighed just under 200 pounds. So therefore I'm aiming somewhere one, 150 to 200 Well, it's definitely 150 Yeah. You know, if you're, what do you say? Yeah, 200 pounds, 100? Well, I wouldn't like to say that much, no more like 193

19:33

so let's go towards so 190 to 210 Yeah, is your range? Think of ranges? I think everyone's like, Oh, I, you know, obviously we give, we give a target for someone. So, yeah, 180 grams for me, 200 grams for you, it's a target. If you get either side of that, 20 grams, let's call it 10% you're doing well, you're never going to nail Exactly. And I think again, like athletes, i.

20:00

Get messages from some athletes. And obviously we work with a type A personality, I think, and with triathletes. And,

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you know, oh, I missed it by five grams. Yes, dude. Like, not only is tracking like, there's going to be some degree of error in tracking, whether it's your visual what you're doing from a weighing perspective, from the back of the label, that isn't 100% accurate trends, trends are important. So yes, hand of protein, the hand of protein, should weigh roughly 200 grams, which is what, seven ounces. Yep, something like that thickness of a deck of cards,

20:40

something like that on your plate. Okay, give or take, depending on how big your hand is, maybe weigh it the first time, chicken breast, one. But again, visualizing on your plate so big piece of protein, plant or animal, lots of veggies, you know, some fruit on there. Starchy carbs are layered in based on what you need, okay, and then just typically, the fat just take care of itself through the protein. So if you're an animal, if you are an omnivore, and you consume animal protein, there's a good chance a lot of fat will be maintained on there. Now, again, you can add good quality fats, so olive oils, avocado oils, avocado olives, omega threes through if you think of the Smash acronym, do you know the Smash acronym? No, no shock. I do. Actually, sardines, mackerel, anchovies, salmon, herring, best sources of mega threes. That's there's another, there's another phrase of that issue, which is called Hell on Earth.

21:41

I love my omega three. I like my sorting. So I recommend these a lot. Fantastic sources of fats in terms of omega threes, fantastic source of protein. Include them. You know, do you want to swallow a pill every day or several pills to get your Omega three core

22:01

intake? Or can you start consuming one of those five types of oily fish in your daily consumption? And I say to people like, try and eat fish once a day, and they're like, Whoa, I can't eat fish once a day. And I'm like, Well, you got three meals in the day. Why can't you? And then actually, if they start to build it into their habit, whether it's breakfast with some smoked salmon, some sardines, some tin salmon, some smoked mackerel, some pickled herring. Okay, well, there was five options for five different things. For breakfast, maybe you could do that in lunch. Obviously, don't want to be that co worker who brings in tin fish. I got told this by Mel, my partner. She's like, I went into a co working space, and she's like, I said, Oh, I'm gonna pack my lunch. Because I packed my lunch, because that's what I do. But she's like, I packed some sardines and that she just took them out. She would Don't be that guy. Don't be that guy. Be that guy. So probably if you do work in a in a an office space, breakfast or dinner at home with your smelly fish. But you can certainly bring it into your habit formation, your daily nutrition intake, eating more fish. I think it's a wonderful thing to include in your dietary intake. So that would be another habit that I would certainly, you know, start to instill from a food perspective, you know, where do you get your omega threes from? You can get a lot of it from fish, if you stick to those five fish in the Smash acronym. How about beyond the the athlete, and I guess, to finish the athlete with these foundational habits, if you really start to build in a really good platform of health as training demands go up,

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is it? Is it a nice rule of thumb? I know it's not the bullseye, that as your training demands go up and you start hitting more intensity, more hours, basically, then you're layering on top of these habits. So these habits never change. That's your foundation of eating. That's just bad quality eating, and then the throttle is really adding calories on top of it with a probably a high ratio of carbohydrates. Is that a nice rule of thumb? Perfect, exactly. And that's exactly how we do it. To keep it simple, if you'll end so high to moderate protein, your fat tends to look after itself. Additional fats in as we discussed, as required base of good quality carbohydrates and fiber and whatnot. And then layering in so it goes from a red meal, as we would describe it, lower carbohydrate, to a yellow meal, which you've layered in some carbohydrates on top of the vegetable, from the vegetables that could be a piece of toast, yeah, breakfast, okay, that's another, you know, two pieces of toast gonna give you what, 30 grams of carbs. Great lunch, cupped hand of, you know, a cup of cooked brown rice. Yep, lay it in dinner. Could be some quinoa couscous. Could be a.

25:00

Rice. It could be pasta, but it's just layering on top of your foundation. And that's the simple thing. It goes from a red meal to a yellow, and from a yellow to a green, which, again, every athlete loves to see some green on their their plan. It doesn't mean green is pasta only. It doesn't mean green is pizza only it. You've got all these wonderful grains that you can choose from these days that you walk into any supermarket and before, I mean, you only had rice or pasta. Now you've got couscous, quinoa, Farrow,

25:35

amaranth. You've got all these different grains that you can explore, and they will provide you with great quality carbohydrates, lots of carbohydrates, fiber, as required. Obviously, you can reduce fiber in and around heavy training sessions and races, but on a daily basis, taking in large amounts of volume is going to help you with gut health, and that's important. It's going to help Everyone's searching for this, the average person takes in less than 15 grams of fiber per day, the recommended amount somewhere between 35 and 45 grams of fiber. How do you get that

26:13

good quality, good quality food? So I think if we extract all it, and I'll go into coach mode and just hopefully, as a listener, just remember this, which is, I think the biggest mistake that I see is that athletes, particularly, because we're focused on athletes right now, think about healthy eating, and then there is a light switch, almost like this, the other side of the moon, The Dark Side of The Moon of now I'm training. It's just carbs, carbs, carbs. So it's pizzas, it's fries, it's potatoes. Get the calories in, if you can just shift your relationship with that and think, no matter what is occurring, healthy eating, the bedrock those vegetables you talked about, tons of fiber, appropriate proteins, and then you layer on top of this foundation. That's why it's called a foundation, the additional carbohydrates from the world of sources that there are, that's where you start to get the unlock. And this is the time to get the bedrock right. This is the time you're not going to suddenly shift your eating habits when you're six weeks out of a race and you're thinking about this, I think this is the great time for habit development. And I mean, what I really want to stress here as well, there is not this notion of Clean Eating versus dirty eating. And yeah, Jan and I have had many conversations around this, like, what is clean eating? And he certainly is on that side of the spectrum that is very focused on clean eating, and yes, I believe in good quality food. It doesn't mean you need to exclude other foods at the expense of calories, if calories are required, however, for again, if we think back to the carbohydrate conversation around how much carbohydrates do a lot of athletes need, then it's similar to total calories for how much do a lot of athletes need as well, in day to day setting, if you're doing 20 plus hours,

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probably even over 15 hours, yes, your caloric requirement is going to be much considerable. If you are this pretty typical, like, I don't know, but 15 hours, a lot of training for me with a full time job, I don't get anywhere near that these days. Like time starved somewhere between six and 10 hours exactly, it is actually interesting. Like, your energy intake can be majority of time accomplished with really great quality fruit, vegetables, good quality, proteins, fats and whatnot. Now in session fueling, don't neglect it exactly. And yes, there is this separation, but there's also this layering, realization that it's okay to eat, gels, drink, carbohydrate drinks, whatnot, high glycemic, processed, ultra processed carbohydrates in sessions that require it is you can eat all the vegetables and fruits in the world, but if you then don't fuel those sessions correctly, you're going to come unstuck. Eventually. You'll last for a while and then make people might be going, Oh, you look amazing, because maybe you are stripping down fat, but it will bite you in the bum eventually, eventually. And so fuel those sessions correctly based on the intensity of the duration.

29:35

Fuel outside of that with total calories, your macro nutrient breakdown, like we've described, with those foundational sort of elements to it, and when you combine those, that's when you see results. And I think whether you're in off season, pre season or season, it's again, it's just refocusing. It's just changing your focus to what you're trying to achieve. And you.

30:00

Yeah, that's again, coming full circle in this conversation. It's like nutrition is so central to everything that you're trying to achieve, so don't neglect it. Just because you don't have a race, yep, just because you don't have a race does not mean nutrition is now not a focus. Yes, you can pull back. You don't need to track everything's super hard, but at least have a structure, because that structure means that you don't have to think so much exactly, and it just allows you to get on with the fun stuff, training, sleeping well and eating well. So on a broader horizon, want to talk, and this still sweeps up a lot of athletes, but it's not athlete specific folks that are looking to improve body composition. You talked about a bedrock of great eating habits. Shift the conversation a little bit. You don't need to retread over a ground that you've already trodden over in the front part of the show. You talked about fiber, vegetables, proteins. What about any considerations for someone, athlete or otherwise, by the way, the key considerations and perhaps some of the pitfalls to avoid, if the goal, the mission is to improve body composition, what's some of your general advice for folks that are looking to actually improve their body composition? I think sleep's a big one. And I know that sort of sleeps always one of those interesting ones with nutrition. Is it nutrition? Not really, but it has such a strong relationship, as I've described before, with nutrition, that I think what we're seeing with the research as well, if you have limited amount of sleep, it will make you, or force your brain, to think about hedonistic choices, salty and sweet. So I think sleep is one of those unrecognized like key elements if you and it seems to have an impact on modulation or prioritization of fat as a fuel source versus, say, carbohydrates as well. So if you want to try and improve the ability to use fat as a fuel source, then potentially sleep could be one of those key elements to think about. So I think sleep and time in bed is not sleep. Yep. Okay. So if everyone tracking either with an aura ring, a whoop or a watch, I would, you know, suggest that look at your time in bed and at least minus one hour from that is, that's the typical, typical, that's what. That's an easy sort of thing. Okay, I'm in bed for nine hours. Okay, you get eight hours sleep

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time. Now, you could talk about the the synchronization of circadian rhythm and things like that, and stages, but I think at least as a habit, to start with time asleep, yep, and even if you don't track, just use that general rule of thumb without going down a rabbit hole. No, I'm

32:45

not gonna You don't need to talk about it, but it is really a key consideration for a woman in perimenopause who, because of a host of reasons, has a really hard time

32:58

getting really good sleep quality and often, is sitting with the body, unable to get into a parasympathetic state, in other words, a really rested state. And I think that that has a correlation to a lot of the challenges around body composition as well, like just that connection of body and sleep is just constantly in a high stress environment. Yeah. I mean, I again, I haven't seen a lot of the research on that, so I'm not going to comment on it, but we can talk about perimenopause and menopausal women. So something about body composition, what we have seen in the research, and there's a cool study that came out of Sydney University, which looked at the reason, and again, I hear this from menopausal women a lot. I can't lose weight, I can't shift body fat. Look at your protein intake. Yeah, now when, and it seems obvious, the study came out that when menopausal women did not hit their high protein intake, and I think it was over 1.8 grams per kilo, byte, so high again, in that recommendation, where we push it, which is about one gram per pound. So at least look again that simple, think of whatever you weigh in pounds trying to eat that somewhere between that two and three grams per kilo body weight, which is what we push at fuel in if they don't hit that, what happens is, well, they will choose or reach for fat or carbohydrate sources of food. Now you think, Well, what else they're going to reach for? Okay, makes sense. However, fat calorie dense, the most calorie dense macro nutrient. So instantly, if you over consume or eat too much of that fatty food, calorie intake goes up. Carbohydrates, super easy to over consume total quantity of carbohydrates. So again, total calorie intake goes up. So it's not that it's nothing magic about this. Again, it comes down to calories when you neglect protein. Okay, again, it probably keeps you feeling fuller, but it has some other impact on, say, the thermic effect of food and slice bumps.

35:00

Metabolism, whatnot. But if you don't hit that, the problem is a cascading in from a practical element. And it's like it, I had to read the study about four or five times to say, get what they were saying. But it's that practical element you just over consume fatty and carbohydrate food types which pushes total calorie intake up, yeah, as now, does that apply to perimenopausal young females? Probably. Does it apply to young males and older males? Probably. So just think about that, the bedrock, if body, I mean, I guess the body one thing is, body composition is a goal.

35:43

Protein. Eat with eat with protein and your fiber on your and what does fiber do? Yep, fiber fills you up. Yeah. And again, are you hitting that 4045, grams of fiber intake per day? Hell no. Hell no. Now people aren't. Am I going to recommend that you go from 10 to 15 grams of fiber to 45 grams of fiber a day. No, because you're going to feel very full of some Yeah.

36:10

Build it up. Bit like carbohydrate intake on the bike or the run, yeah, build it up. Build up. Layer it in. So I say from a body composition standpoint, yes, protein we talk about a lot. It is super important, I think, from that perspective, what about dehydration? Because a lot of folks walk around like dried sponges, and one of the symptoms of dehydration is hunger. And so that must have an impact as well, because on daily life, most people forget about training. We're not talking about athletes here. Most people do not consume. We just came back from a workshop and the working with a leadership team. So these are high performers in life. And across the 12, people were working with the average daily consumption of fluids that they were self reflecting on in the weeks in tracking in the couple of weeks leading in was about half a liter to a liter a day, just not enough water, especially if you look if you're stuck indoors, in air conditioning and things like that exactly, might be losing a lot more fluid than what you think about. So, yeah, I mean, we it's interesting, isn't it? We have reminders in fuel, in for hydrate, and some people are like, I don't want that reminder in there. And we were thinking of making it optional, but actually we're going to keep it in as a mandatory just reminder, because it does actually, well, I shouldn't say actually, it does remind you, oh, actually, I haven't drunk any, and I'm thinking to myself now I've had two coffees and not one drop of water when we're sitting here without any water on the table for a run this morning. Yeah. I'm like, I am, actually, yeah. So I think fluid intake, and as you mentioned, if you are dehydrated, that could mimic hunger. So you go and drink a liter or half a liter of fluid, suddenly you're like, actually, I'm not that hungry anymore. Now, could it be boredom? The other thing to think about from body composition, you're sitting down all day, you're in front of the computer. Oh, there's a packet of chips or crisps next to you. What do you do? You eat it because you're bored and you're it's that bored, hunger. Get up, go for a walk, do some air squats, do some push ups, something like that. Suddenly you're like, oh, maybe I'm not. So there is there? I think there's a big psychological element. There's other impacts on body composition. For folks that are amateur athletes, I believe, where, you know, neat, yeah, non exercise, activity, thermogenesis, we we went through the with this leadership group as well, and we tracked and and we looked at the five folks that were consistently training to some level. And so there was one person that was really into group fitness. Okay? They did something every day, someone else, couple of folks that happened to be triathletes, etc, but their average steps per day outside of their one hour of exercise that they typically did per day was incredibly low. So they drove to the office, they walked to the office, they sat in the office. They're not burning any calories. They're moving around. It was unbelievable. It was three to 4000 steps a day. Then they would go and exercise an hour on the trainer. I think that's a factor of particularly in America, I would say, with the infrastructure at all the cities here and not set up for walking, etc, etc, that's probably another component. When you think about body composition, it's just increasing your daily movement, yeah. And I think separating,

39:24

you know, separating out exercise from activity, yeah, exactly. That is something that I tend to when, if I'm coaching an athlete is talking about that don't just you can do 45 minutes group exercise and then sit on the couch or at your desk the rest of the day, and again, working from home in post COVID, you get up from the bed, you walk to the shower, you walk to the kitchen, you walk to your breakfast table, you sit on the couch, but all up, you could look at your watch at the end of the day and go, Oh, 1500 steps exactly. That's not enough activity, even with a 45 minute exercise.

40:00

Size session, your actual total, again estimated, and again you can take pinch of salt with any estimation. Is that. I mean, it might only be 1800 calories for the entire day, but because you've sat in your house, you've got all these snacks around you. You sit at your desk eating that. You have your breakfast, your lunch, your dinner, you have a few snacks. Before you know it, you've consumed two and a half 3000 calories, and you wonder why, despite exercising every day, things aren't going the way you want. So

40:30

probably my take home for body composition is perception versus reality. Now, if you're struggling from a body composition perspective track like, do some favor. And I know the rest of your life, I know, but, and a lot of there will be the kickback, Oh, you don't need to track, no, actually account for what goes in your mouth, at least for several weeks, and be meticulous about how you're actually tracking that. And then you will start to realize, Oh, my God,

41:02

you know, four tablespoons of peanut butter on my toast in the morning. Maybe I don't need that. Maybe I don't need half an avocado on my salad. Maybe I don't need that. Again, portion control is really important, and

41:21

yes, there can be that argument that tracking can create all sorts of negative habits, and I don't disagree, however, it can also give great insight to an individual about what they're doing on a daily basis. And I think again, when it's managed and used correctly, it can be empowering. Can be completely empowering. And then, as we described, you can use other strategies, visualization techniques. As you get better, like I don't have to track every day, I can look at my plate and go, Okay, I've got enough veggies. I've got enough fruit. I've eaten this in a day. I understand the amount of protein around racing. Okay, I've got a specific purpose now. So it's horses for courses. If your focus is body composition, then dial it in until you get to the point where you're very, very comfortable and you are where you are from a health perspective, again, improvement in body composition is not just losing weight, it's increasing or maintaining lean mass as you reduce body fat, visceral component. That's a key component. I know we've talked about azem pick stuff like that in the past, and we won't go down that rabbit hole. I did write an article about this, which was recent Jan, and I talked about it was,

42:39

I think azem Pick is fascinating, yep.

42:42

However, the potential drawbacks on it is, yes, you lose rapid amounts of weight in the form of fat, but also at the cost of lean mass. Now, what does that do as you come off azempic and potentially go back up in weight, but that weight is gained in fat, but you've lost huge amounts of muscle.

43:04

That's where potential issues could come out in the long term. So I think it's a space to watch, and again, it's a rabbit hole. I'll give you my one minute perspective, and we'll wrap up, which is, it's fascinating, and the next 10 years, it's the first time in decades that obesity has gone down in America, mostly related to the GLP or azepic family of drugs. There's all sorts of interesting stuff emerging and emerging, and we don't talk about it with of what it's doing with clarity and cognitive function. And is there anything there?

43:38

I don't terms a negative in no terms of positives that you like, that they're starting to think that they understand we don't understand the long term potential risks of it. It's really interesting of this balance between long term health risks and long term benefits, when you're talking about a total population that is 50% overweight or obese, and beyond 50% well beyond 50% and I mean, look, 93% are metabolically unhealthy, correct? The biggest catalyst for anyone that is, I guess, the only recommendation I would have if anyone is considering this is like anything else, if you only think about it as the drug, as a catalyst for change, and then you are likely going down a cul de sac. It is a tool that for some people, might theoretically be useful, but it needs to come in, and this is one of the the frustrations. It needs to come in conjunction with serious habit change around a lot of what we talked about, nutritional habits, exercise, movement and daily activity, sleep, etc. And then for some people, there might be a case where you look at the guidelines for it, it's meant to be done in conjunction with lifestyle intervention that no one's doing. It's not a weight loss drug. And I mean, you talk about those interventions.

45:00

Patients that has to be what you eat on a daily basis, like and building those everything we talked about weights training like, my personal view is cardio is out the window. Yep, that point in time when you're on that drug, you are lifting heavy, repetitive weights for three to four times a week to try and retain or maintain or increase potentially lean mass, high protein intake to train again, try and offset any losses in lean mass with you all that are occurring and strength first you are going to come off this drug at some point. Yeah, it's expensive, but B you probably once you hit your goal, then you come off any drug for life, hopefully. Now, hopefully, like most dieting, you know, programs in that if you don't have the habits built in, lo and behold, you yo, yo, you bounce back. And it could be disaster, with negative consequences, as you said, because you might have lost lean body management. So it look. It's a get. I'm not an expert in JLP ones. You know, it's fascinating to read about. It's interesting to comment on. And I think there's going to be a lot more. I mean, there seems to be a lot more. I'm seeing research paper after research papers coming out, but we don't have the longitudinal studies at this point in time. We talked about hydration, all a bit key. We talked about protein. We talked about fiber. Is there anything else for folks that are just looking to improve the longevity piece?

46:30

Well, so the longevity piece, I think first and foremost,

46:36

things like intermittent fasting, fasting, all that. No, it's not a panacea for longevity. I think that's pretty clear. I think even some of the experts in longevity, you will have heard them, they've talked about their mistakes with intermittent fasting, fasting, intermittent fasting and time restricted fasting. It's a tool in the toolbox for those individuals. Again, most of the research is around metabolically unfit, overweight, male, female individuals middle age, and it has some impact on those individuals. Again, it's not clear cut the difference between intermittent fasting, time restricted fasting and caloric restriction pretty much the same when it's all equated in terms of energy balance. So

47:20

don't think that you have to do that to live longer. I think first and foremost, resveratrol, I was talking about this the other day, again, another, you know, stake in its heart. It's not some magic compound that's going to make you live longer, yeah, do you know what makes you live longer? Exercise, exercise changes, telomeres. It is the number, number one consistent thing by a country mile on terms of longevity and reduction of disease. Well, you're 70 are yes, I'm 72 and I'm co founder of the Marin chapter of AARP, and we have got a great society. It's a wonderful question, but you can impact like, I love how you know, like Bora Garmin, they all give you your age, yeah, don't they, yeah. Where do you sit on that? And look, it's a made up number metric. I'm sure they're using some algorithm to do it. But where do you actually sit? If you want to again, if you're tracking things, what does your age actually say on that, are you seven years younger, eight years younger, or actually, are you older? I read a report for a client of mine the other day. They're, you know, based on all their heart testing and their cholesterol and their blood sugar, isn't that they're 10 years older than what they are.

48:38

Now, again, that's a theoretical age, but telling. It's telling. So again, look at the data with everything that you because you're hell bent on living forever, which I don't know why you'd want to do that, but

48:53

look at what you're doing. Are you exercising daily? Doesn't have to be mad, but doing something. Are you exercising? Are you staying active? Are you eating, those foundational principles we talked about, and are you sleeping? That's it. Probably the only other thing from longevity is stress. Stress Management. Stress can be noxious and stress can be productive. Again, I think a lot of individuals hear the word stress and think it's bad. Exactly what is exercise? Exercise is stress on the body. What does stress do with the right amount of stress and the right nutrition, it creates adaptation in a positive way. So stress on the body, not allowing it to be too high, not allowing it to be too low, getting that balance right. Again, I can think of training peaks in particular, they do a nice little graph that shows you where your stress is and how it's relating to adaptation and where you should be going. I actually looked at it more recently. I was like, that's interesting. Is the bill towards the marathon? Pretty much been on point. Feel good. Stress gets too high, you get sick, you get injured.

50:00

And stress gets too low. You d train you. You get worse than what you're trying to achieve. So I think those four things, that's what will make you live longer. There you go. Great way to finish. Well done. Thank you very much, my friend. Thanks, mate. See you. And trouble back safe down under to the land of dirtiness, and we'll go from there. Thank you very much for being on the show, Scott, and thanks for listening, folks. We'll see you next time. Take care,

50:26

guys. Thanks so much for joining and thank you for listening. I hope that you enjoyed the new format. You can never miss an episode by simply subscribing. Head to the purple patch channel of YouTube, and you will find it there. And you could subscribe, of course, I'd like to ask you if you will subscribe. Also Share It With Your Friends, and it's really helpful if you leave a nice, positive review in the comments. Now, any questions that you have, let me know, feel free to add a comment, and I will try my best to respond and support you on your performance journey. And in fact, as we commence this video podcast experience, if you have any feedback at all, as mentioned earlier in the show, we would love your help in helping us to improve. Simply email us at info, at purple patch fitness.com, or leave it in the comments of the show at the purple patch page, and we will get you dialed in. We'd love constructive feedback. We are in a growth mindset, as we like to call it, and so feel free to share with your friends. But as I said, Let's build this together. Let's make it something special. It's really fun. We're really trying hard to make it a special experience, and we want to welcome you into the purple patch community with that. I hope you have a great week. Stay healthy, have fun, keep smiling, doing whatever you do, take care you.